http://www.r-word.org/

My ex kept up a pretty consistent campaign to change my use of language on a day to day basis. Namely, she punched me or pinched me in the groin every time I used the word "retard" or "moron", or referred to something as "retarded". She maintained this course of well-intentioned physical abuse long after we'd broken up, and I wound up being punched a few times when I saw her on Saturday. And now she's posted this on my facebook wall. I'm wondering what you guys think.

Personally, I don't use "gay" as a pejorative, on the basis that it contributes in a small way to a hostile environment for gay people, even if I know I'm not trying to be homophobic and I'm sure that no one I'm saying it around feels like I am, either. But I think "retard" is different. Firstly, I don't think mentally disabled people actually give a shit, possibly unless they're prickly "aspie" fuckwits who would take offense at literally anything, anyway. I'm autistic/Aspergers myself, and I certainly don't care. I have never had a mentally challenged person challenge my use of this word. And I've never had much patience for people who decide to be offended on behalf of other people, and that seems to be what this is.

I am biased, though, because I find "retarded" to be an incredibly versatile and useful word, and not only would it take considerable effort to moderate and eventually stamp out my usage entirely, but I would sorely miss it, were it removed from my lexicon.

On the other hand, apparently Dr Cox supports this cause, so now I don't know what to think. Thoughts?

Your ex is retarded, man.

Unlike being gay, it is bad. They literally have something wrong with them.

To call someone a retard is to say "factors beyond your control have made you vexatiously stupid." Often a completely true statement for reasons less related to genetics than Down's or suchlike.

You know, I was all ready to have a proper discussion with you until I got to "vexatiously stupid".

I get that you hate disabled people. You've made that abundantly clear. What gives you the right to continually hurt and upset their families by using the kind of language both under discussion and used here?

"Spastic" in the UK is worse, and in the US it doesn't even mean anything. It's about as troubling an insult as "doofus." If you asked 100 people, I doubt any would know that it used to be used as a medical term

"Retarded" technically means "Slowed". Delayed, in other words. They used to say, "backwards."

I almost never use the word, except when I am with my friends and it is clear we are making fun of bigots, not being them. Though there are times when it's exactly the word I want to get a point across, and I have to stop and reconfigure what I was going to say, because no other word quite cuts the mustard (muster).

"Retarded" is rarely used any more to refer to the developmentally disabled (a term I actually like, because it is more descriptive rather than simply obfuscating). Even using it appropriately is becoming a problem.

"Midget" used to be the proper word for little people who aren't dwarfs. But now it's become considered derogatory. Still used to refer to things like midget staplers.

Indian Giver, Paddy Wagon, Welshing on a debt, dumb, lame, "spastic" in the US -- eventually, pejoratives can die out. "Gay" will probably do that. Linguistically, it serves a purpose that's not precisely fillable with any other word. We cannot police language drift very well -- trying to usually makes things worse.

"Simple" used to be gently pejorative, too, not that I think of it.

And don't get me started on "niggardly."

The fact that I don't have any kind of business relationship with them and am not seeking them out for the purpose of further bothering?

So, basically, "why should I give a shit how that makes you feel? I'm not ACTIVELY TRYING to make you feel like shit, It's just an incidental byproduct, and we're not close or anything. So that's totally cool. I'm not being a douche, because I'm not actively trying to hurt people, I just don't care whether I do or not!"

I don't understand why people care about hurting others by using "gay" in that way, but those who are upset about this issue are branded overly PC and much worse--even when they have a personal stake in it. I tend to let it go (except when there is a debate ABOUT it, such as here) precisely because of the negative reaction to people who disagree with it. However, if I had even more of a personal stake in it-- if I had a child who was developmentally disabled, say--you bet your ass I'd be coming down hard on people who upset me that way, and I feel that I'd have every right to be hurt. For some reason, other people don't. I don't understand that.

It's going to be hard for you to consider what I'm saying anything other than trolling, Pixie, and I can even completely understand why. Believe it or not, I am capable of empathy. Being aware of why you are hurt does not make me believe that your position makes sense, though.

This, again, is not trolling, but an honest explanation of why my side thinks the way it does. It doesn't even really involve hatred. I'd be lying if I said that were a totally solved issue for me, (I do, at least, recognize it as an issue in need of solving.) but for most people on this side of the debate, that's very much not the case.

Disability is bad. It causes its sufferers to have difficulty in their everyday lives, bars them from a variety of experiences, hinders their ambitions, and (I guess this is the part that makes you angry?) causes inconvenience and discomfort to others.

Suppose somebody is walking down the street with a basket. Somebody bumps into them, spilling the contents. "What the fuck, man? Are you blind?"

Now, suppose the person is blind.

What you seem to think: "how awful! That poor person. The guy with the basket is such an asshole!"

What I think: "uh... it's not an insult, then. What's the problem?"

As has been pointed out, the people hurt by these things aren't the sufferers, but their families, caretakers, etc. The thing is... why? What's it matter? They aren't disabled, and their charges don't care, so what is the problem? The answer, ultimately, is that they have not finished grieving. Which is understandable, to a certain degree. But there is a vast number of people involved here who seem to make a point of being stuck in the "anger" stage. They berate people, and bring unrelated people who just enjoy berating into the fray, and make this whole movement based on making people not be offensive, where offense is defined by their fairly arbitrary capacity to be offended due to the aforementioned incomplete process of grief.

It makes them look kind of silly, is all. Nothing to do with any ire towards the disabled themselves.

Yes, language changes. But we're not there yet.

Nope, but I expect that's the way it'll go. Good or bad? Dunno. Language is emergent behavior, and the collective species is a bit of a dick.

Nope, but I expect that's the way it'll go. Good or bad? Dunno. Language is emergent behavior, and the collective species is a bit of a dick.

But are they *wolves*?! ARE THEY??!!!

I was thinking, and I'm going to ask an honest question: could someone actually point me to a recent occurence where the word "retard" was not used in a mean, hurtful, or spiteful way, even when referring to the mentally handicapped?

"Gay" can go both ways, after all, used to describe homosexuals and as an insult.  But "retard" or "retarded", from what I can recall, is almost never used except as an insult.

Just a thought, one that Scix touched on earlier.  I'm not sure where I'm going with this, but it's a thought.  Could it be with how society, in the general sense, sees mentally-challenged people that it's somewhat socially acceptable?

Personally, I see it as a point of laziness.  To say about something "that's retarded!" (or "retarted" as the spelling-challenged internet forum trolls would spell it) just reeks of an inability to think up a more robust, original insult.

But likely more the first one.

...am I making any sense here?  It's been a long day, and it's far past my bed time to really try to post in an intellectual debate on this topic.